More than one commenter on yesterday's post about tweels in development for the military expressed curiosity about the possibility of non-pneumatic bicycle tires. Turns out you can buy them, online, right now, from here, and here, and probably some other places that don't turn up in a Froogle search. I have not tried them myself but I'd be curious to have comments from anyone who has.
Posted by Sean Michael Ragan |
Sep 11, 2009 05:47 AM
Bicycles, News from the Future, Online, Transportation |
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As a side note I didn't realise Froogle still existed. They changed it to "Google shopping" on the UK site I would say a couple of years ago. Strange.
Those prices seem too good to be true, I wonder what the quality is like and how long they last before they perish/go bald?
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aka Google product search (beta)
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Sadly, yes, they changed the name, which was like the best name ever. I have persisted in using it out of protest.
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From http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_aa-l.html#airless
Of all the inventions that came out of the bicycle industry, probably none is as important and useful as Dr. Dunlop's pneumatic tire.
Airless tires have been obsolete for over a century, but crackpot "inventors" keep trying to bring them back. They are heavy and slow. They give a harsh ride and poor high-speed cornering on rough surfaces. They are also likely to cause wheel damage, due to their poor cushioning ability.
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...to Sheldon Brown, his argument seems to be based on the assumption that materials science has not advanced since 1890.
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Material science has definitely advanced, but are we necessarily using it here?
Sure, our tire rubber is better, we have different tread patterns, etc., but most of these tires seem to attempt to just add some rubber ribs to make up for air. As a result, it doesn't distribute pressure throughout the tire.
I think it's a feasible idea, but not simply by adding rubber ribs.
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but difficult to back up. Sheldon Brown was THE authority on all sorts of bike engineering. His website taught countless makers to fix, mod, and hack their rides. look him up on the wikipedia- he knew what he was talking about. RIP Sheldon.
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Google "nu-teck aireless reviews" and check some of the bikeforums.net discussions which are fairly detailed. Road/Urban riders seemed mixed, but I couldn't find much for MTB riders which may be due to the decreased absorption of airless tires v. pneumatics. I was surprised that weight was only a few hundred grams heavier for the MTB airless versus a self-healing tube and tire setup.
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that should be "shock absorption"...
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I've got a lot of bike riding experiance including a few long distance trips. My longest one being coast to coast across Canada a few years ago. I tried many types of airless tires the see if they would be a good choice for long trips and none have come even close to being good enough to consider. The main problem I have is that don't have the right give to them. What I mean by that is that they feel fine with norman meight or presure on them but a sudden force like standing up on the pedals and pushing down hard ot climb a hill they feel soft, and when taking a corner I've foudn that all but one type (I can't recall the make) made the back end feel loose. Overall I think they are great for a childs bike because of their light weight or for slow moving commuter type travel but I can't recomend them yet for serious biking. I think the main hurdel a good airless wheel needs to overcome is not the softnes or hardness but it's resistance to sidways shear, I'd take a sofer tire that did'nt feel loose on corners to a harder one that did. I'd love a good set of those honeycomb looking ones for my motorcycle if I was going on a longer tip.
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as i understand those.. they are just solid rubber tires.. the analog would be solid rubber car tires.. which.. we don't use because they're stupid.
These are equally stupid for bikes.. they're a rough ride and they ruin rims.
Show me a tweel for a bike.. (plastic spoke material with an open collapsible airspace that mimics pneumatic compression) and i'll be excited.
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I suppose the goal here is to mimic an air tire that redistributes pressure across the entire tire.
However, do you really need deforming spokes for that?
It seems to me the honeycomb wheel idea is good for higher loads, but that it should be possible to redistribute pressure through the tire area alone with the use of a structure instead of air (provided the pressure wasn't too high for the materials). That would be harder to accomplish on, say, a car because of the higher forces, but I think it should be okay on a bike.
Still, it would require some different materials in a different geometric structure, not just some rubber ribs.
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I was looking into these and what I came away with is...
1.) Sites that sell them have terrible service
2.) Most people say the traction and rolling resistance is too different
3.) There are ways to get a tubed tire reasonably puncture proof with fix a flat, thick walled tubes, and armadillo tires.
I may get a pair just to see but so far... the last few weeks of research are telling me otherwise.
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I rode on one of these for a few months. Not only was it like riding on sand, it also started popping spokes on my bike like toothpicks. Getting the tire off to replace the spokes was no easy feat. I eventually chucked it and replaced the wheel.
On a powered vehicle, I expect it would decrease mileage fairly significantly.
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I have a fleet of bikes I maintain for our kids and I have tried several different "airless" tubes and the results have been consistent across the board - they weigh a lot more, the ride is much stiffer and they are much more expensive.
I just use Slime in thicker tubes. That may not produce much of a price break but the ride is the same and the weight gain is not noticeable.
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I rode on a bike in Ravenna, Italy, that had airless tires through the city's free bicycle program. They were terrible.
It may be that there are some super-fancy materials out there that can make airless tires feel as good a pneumatic tires, but I'd be surprised. The things felt like they were filled with lead. They were super heavy and provided no give at all to bumps in the road.
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I remember having airless tires on my first bike as a kid (around 1990). They were some sort of foam and much lighter than normal rubber tires. I can't remember how they rode, but with training wheels does it really matter? :D
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You can buy them at www.noflattires.net
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I got mine from my local walmart a couple months ago.
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I purchased a couple airfree tires on-line last month (September 2009) for my commuter bicycle. One was totally defective (cords not properly encased by support material) and the other hard a serve hard spot keeping me from even thinking of going over about 15MPH. That said the Customer Service is worse. Please do yourself a favor and stay way. I have struggled for 6 weeks, not to get a refund, but to just get REPLACEMENTS! The product and service is worthless.
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I am not sure how much I trust these airless tires. I have ridden on them before and it is rather difficult to even gain speed. It is almost an indescribable feeling, but one of the comments above stated its like riding on sand. More or less quick sand if you asked me.
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